Protest against Traveller eviction in Cork

by traverlator Thu Jun 29, 2006 13:02

the trespass law

ie they are tresspassing, travellers still have the misguided notion that they can set up shop wherever the fuck they want , ignoring the most basic of laws that every other single person has to adhere to and in the process absolutely destroy the area by dumping rubbish all over the place and then take advantage of some bleeding hearts organisation to claim they are being victimised when any other law abiding person would be locked up in an instant if they tried the same thing, shure the guy down the road has gone on holidays, lets all head into his field and pitch up like we actually own the place, shure lets dump rubbish all over the shop and ignore the owner when he/she says get off my land, try to claim the area --then actually sell on sites to other travellers who then claim that they **own** the land --fuck right off, lock em up i say and make them clean up all the shit that they leave behind

by Chris Murray - The Unmanageables Thu Jun 29, 2006 12:38

West Cork is a lovely area.
Very expensive and quite a large holiday home community taking up
sites all over the mountains, especially in areas like Lisin na Cre.

The Housing Bill reffered to, the trespass law. allows the speculators,
developers and tax-dodgers to throw an indigenous community
of their land so they can avoid millions of euros worth of tax. millions.
these house are largely unoccupied but roads and services are installed
for the tax dodgers. who, probably do not pay bin tax, since they don't pay
anything else.
A couple of the top echelon , not the ordinary third house buying
grubby little millionaire, were at Charlie haugheys funeral (front row centre).

They own the media, communications infrastructure of Ireland.

BTW : My kids curse a blue streak.

Laws that corral human beings to the point of indignity and blatantly
support the already rich are bad laws dear.

by Lisa - buffer Thu Jun 29, 2006 12:16

My name is Lisa, I live in West cork and we are surrounded by Travellers- most of them are really nice people, but sometimes you cannot even look at them and they start shouting abuse at you and they are "always right". They think they have the right to shout at you in pubs and on the streets and to hit you.
Also why is it, you know the travellers dont like being called "knackers and tinkers,"so why do they call us settled people "BUFFERS?"
I think the travelling women are actually ten times worse than the men...you would be in the pub and you might get talking to them and then after about an hour the women thinks that you are after their man, and they start hitting and shouting at you, so no wonder travellers have a "bad reputation" and are barred from pubs.
Yes, most of the travelling community look after their children very well, but they bring up their childrn to curse and everything..I had a run in with a lady traveller and now, every time I see her she starts calling me names , even her 4 children do..eldest is 14, then a 6 year old, 4 year old and a 3 year old. They are always on about other people..why do they have to shout and hit people..if they want to be respected, they will have to stop the way they beheave and travellers are always littering, not because they feel bad of the way the community has been treating them, but because it is in their nature to do so.WE HAVE TO PAY BIN REFUGE TAXES, but the travellers dont. we have to recycle but the travellers dont...why?if we did all the dumping that they did, well what ya know?...we woud be up before the district judge................

by D-rack Wed Jun 28, 2006 13:21

has anybody been up to Dunsink lane in finglas?It could have been called green belt lend at one stage till the "travellers" moved in.They propmtly set up several illegal motor-parts busineses,sold illegal white diesal,counterfeited DVD's,burned wire and turned the entire area into an open air dumping ground which the council repeatedly clears away.When the access to the illegal site was blocked,the travellers rioted for a week,throwing petrol bombs,lumps of concrete and burning tyres at gardai.A crane was set on fire as were several vehicles.cars using the public road were peleted with missiles and frankly its a wonder nobody was killed.In follow up searches in which the traveller thugs screamed "racism",numerous weapons were recovered including huge amounts of stolen goods,counterfeit equipment and firearms.When the council finally decided to evict them,they've dug in and now insist on compensation.The area was described in the sunday world as "the most lawless place in ireland" and this is due to the prescence of the travellers and the parasitic,anti social lifestyle they choose to live and not because of the way they're "treated" by the people who pay taxes to pay thier social welfare handouts.People are sick and tired of these thugs destroying scenic areas,littering,stealing and devaluing houses with thier arrogant assumption that they have the right to live outside the law.

by Chris Murray - The Unmanageables Tue Jun 27, 2006 21:27

Signed into law after a meeting of the Council Of State by President Mary Mc Aleese.

Prob find it on http://www.oireachtas.ie (2002).

by hmmz Tue Jun 27, 2006 16:56

The woman in question had her caravan impounded and was also detained in Garda custody for a period of time, an act which clearly negates individual, Traveller and childrens' human rights

Untill you actually say WHY she was detained and her caravan impounded how can you claim that this negates individual, traveller and childrens human rights?

so being detained in a copshop is against Individual Human rights----Explain that one....

people get vehicles impounded every single day, tis nothing new

no mention of kids being detained so how exactly were their rights infringed upon....

absolutely no substance to this piece of drivel at all

by Poor Tenant Tue Jun 27, 2006 16:21

Why has nobody explained why this lone parent travelling family were moved? Surely, people have a right to hear the full story, people can't just support every travelling person in the land who's being moved, there could be health and safety reasons or they might have been on someone's property etc., and that's not on, but I'm just guessing these events, because there's no detail in the article and I wonder why? I'm genuinely interested. I'll support them if I feel there has been a wrong done to them, but having your caravan moved without on explanation provided in the article is strange surely.

by traverlator Tue Jun 27, 2006 13:24

so you think they leave the litter behind because they could not be bothered to pick it up, because they always have left it behind, and see no reason to change, because they hold us settled people in contempt and seek to take as much advantage of our society as they can? I guess in earlier times when there was less plastic around such disposal of waste may not have been extraordinary. Somehow though I would imagine that an average common which hosted a number of barrel top caravans for a few weeks was kept clean enough to live in. So on that basis I am going to stick with my earlier argument as to why the travelling communities leave their waste behind unless you or they can offer a better one.

Thats just a blatently stupid comment, you can imagine all you want, the blatent fact is most areas around halting sites are like rubbish tips and the bottom line is that they are a health hazard for starters, be honest here --if they were serious they would hire a skip--after all they pay 0 council rates, nope they just dump with absolutely no concern or care and all they do is harm their own prospects with such blatent disregard and contempt from society to which they demand everything and give absolutely nothing, the problem is the majority actually believe that you can demand from society and at the same time hold it in complete contempt--any person who does that usually ends up in one place--Mountjoy
you say they do not want to educate as it hold nothing relevant to them--good point, dont you think its about time they made an effort to make it relevant--i dont see my family mentioned in history books or even maths books, that must mean it has no relevance to me then, it may not have but it has the utmost relevance to how i progress in society and most people accept that, dont want an education--fine just dont crib about it later

by eoino Tue Jun 27, 2006 00:19

so you think they leave the litter behind because they could not be bothered to pick it up, because they always have left it behind, and see no reason to change, because they hold us settled people in contempt and seek to take as much advantage of our society as they can? I guess in earlier times when there was less plastic around such disposal of waste may not have been extraordinary. Somehow though I would imagine that an average common which hosted a number of barrel top caravans for a few weeks was kept clean enough to live in. So on that basis I am going to stick with my earlier argument as to why the travelling communities leave their waste behind unless you or they can offer a better one.

We could take the issue of waste to a more philosophical level and ask why the drivers of cars leave their waste exhaust gasses all over the common air or why the waste products from the combustion of the fossil fuels used to produce electricity are so discarded into the atmosphere thus causing climate change, a far, far, greater crime than a gathering of travellers spoiling the serenity of the walk along the Dodder River for the good citizens of South Dublin.

If only people like you cared about things that mattered.

Btw the comment about terroriseing and robbing was below the belt. Maybe you should go and join them after all...

by Poor Tenant Tue Jun 27, 2006 00:18

I was brought up in a mobile home and I always regarded it as a home. My family were very poor when I was growing up. Shame on you for saying that a mobile home is not a home, it's as good as a house, I loved living in ours, and we lived on a bit of land in the West of Ireland. As regards loans from banks, no bank every helped my family, despite begging and pleading from my parents, so now I've grown-up I'm very reluctant to take out a loan, not that I'd ever get one to buy a house anyway.

I was just pointing out that just because you are a traveller, (and I do know some settled travellers personally), does not excuse them for littering the side of the road, as is often the case, and I don't thing the majority of them are living in hardship, any of them I see live in better conditions than I did growing up.

by iosaf Tue Jun 27, 2006 00:01

Nothing unusual in that, but if the last commentator lived in a large mutually supportive extended family network, it is quite likely he would afford a caravan for at least of one of that network.
Let us assign that hypothetical member "the mammy". Now if the last commentator could afford a caravan for "the mammy", caravans for the other members of the network would be a priority, naturally and now we'll jump up the logic - once enough caravans had been found for the community, and due to logistic limitations of any halting site there is a finite number of caravans or mobile "homes" any extended collective sees as useful - excess money must be saved in some way. It is not advisable to bury savings in the ground under a rock, Fianna Fail might have redeveloped it the next time you come round. So the most common forms of "non-banking asset management" in the world, (yes this whole fecking world) is one of these options :-
1) a car.
2) gold jewelry
3) herds of cattle or other ruminant domesticated quadropeds.

It really is quite astounding how normal "travellers" are when considered on a global basis, it helps to highlight how fnordish settled people who pay exhoribant rent to clear another's mortage or have decided to purchase a morage directly - really are .

So the "look those people have no house but they have an expensive car!"
shite really doesn't work with me. But if you wonder why don't banks offer inclusive service to traveller communities be they indiginous or "new age" I'd be delighted to ponder that. Maybe they do after all do splendid loans to help people start off.... with "the mammy's caravan".

by Poor Tenant Mon Jun 26, 2006 21:07

Please give the full story as to why they were moved on?

I have yet to meet a poverty stricken traveller, any of the ones I know seem well fed, all of them have cars, some have horses and wear nice clothes, and all of them are decent friendly happy easygoing people with plenty of leisure time.

I can't afford a car myself nor can I afford a house, even though I've never been out of work and I have often thought of taking up their traveller lifestyle myself, at least then I could plonk my home anywhere and take-off in my car and not have to do much work and everyone will come out and rally around me with sympathy should anyone dare try to remove my home from the front of your house, or a some major public road, and if I litter the place as well, that too is okay! It would be great, there would be no end to the laws I can break, I could even terrorise and rob someone's house and people would still sympathise with me!

To the person, who said they leave litter because of how badly they are treated by the community - well done, I had a great laugh at that one! - you fool!!!!!

by pat c Mon Jun 26, 2006 18:22

1.—(1) This Act may be cited as the Housing (Miscellaneous Provisions) Act, 2002.

(2) The Housing Acts, 1966 to 1998, and this Act, other than sections 17 to 20, 22, 23 and 24 and Schedules 2 and 3, may be cited together as the Housing Acts, 1966 to 2002, and shall be read together as one Act.

(3) This Act, other than section 12, shall come into operation on such day or days as the Minister may appoint by order or orders either generally or with reference to any particular purpose or provision and different days may be so appointed for different purposes or different provisions or for the repeal of different enactments effected by section 4.

Full text of act at:

by know152 Mon Jun 26, 2006 18:07

Given that this is under the trespass laaw, why no detail of the nature of the land that the person was on? It could be a dangerous turn on the road or someone's front ground for all the information that is provided in the report.

by pat c Mon Jun 26, 2006 16:45

http://www.paveepoint.ie/

Pavee Point
46 North Great Charles Street
Dublin 1, Ireland
Telephone: [+353 1] 8780255
Fax: [+353 1] 8742626
email: pavee@iol.ie

Office Hours
9:30-5:30 Monday-Friday

Public Information Sessions are held the first Wednesday of every month. Booking is essential - for further details contact info@pavee.iol.ie

by Chris Mon Jun 26, 2006 16:41

Otherwise known as the 'Trespass Law'
signed my President Mary Mc Aleese after referral to the Council of State.
Allows for travellers, an Irish Indigenous community to have their vehicles removed, including the ones they live in , and impounded. The bill is a property/land speculation piece of tat.

Contact Pavee Point for information: unfortunately don't have the links.

by eoino Mon Jun 26, 2006 16:22

Ok D-rack and traverlator go and swap places with a member of the traveling community for one day and see how you like it. You'll be refused from pubs because of the way you talk and dress because the "penny halfpenny looking down on penny farthing" Irish need to feel better than someone else. You will face rejection in practically every town in Ireland bar maybe Rathkeale because the locals don't like your sort living near them.

Yes sure the Irish will break all records when it comes to donating money to the developing Worlds ( £7 per head after liveaid ) but when it comes to the indigenous community on their own doorstep their attitude is very "unchristian".

And what of the attitude of the traveling community? Why should they conform to your norms of living in a house or receiving a top down education in subjects which are probably of no interest to most of them (how many chapters or even paragraphs on travelers were in the history books you read at school?) . Furthermore I would say any mess left at a traveller camp reflects the way they feel they have been treated by the community the camp was in.

All I can say is give them a break, they deserve it. If the Fianna Fail government or any Irish government were worth anything the travelers
versus settled people issue would have been sorted out long long ago. However there are no votes in Bertie going public saying he is going to "negotiate" a solution/compromise that all parties can agree to so it won't be happening... In fact it suits politicians to allow prospective
voters to vent steam against the travelers so the politician can promise to "sort it out". Gives them another reason for existing. But of course any standard local politician who implements a solution which favours the settled community is going to cause resentment in the traveler community so once again no solution to the problem...

by traverlator Mon Jun 26, 2006 15:43

What exactly are they fighting for? the right to occupy private/government land whenever they choose, decimate the surrounding enviornment by blatently dumping various rubbish on the land they occupy, and cry foul when they get moved from an area that they have utterly destroyed, if a person living in a house did 1/50th of the damage that they do to the enviornment that they surround they would have fines slapped on them so hard and fast by the council, i say they are getting blatent preferential treatment and its about time they actually CONTRIBUTED something to the society that they live in instead of constantly putting the hand out

by D-rack Mon Jun 26, 2006 14:38

What exactly are rseidents against racism moaning about now?Travellers arent a seperate race of human being the majority in this country.They're white caucasians.The fact that they never seek employment,pay taxes or conform to the law of the land doesnt give them a seperate racial identity.Residents against racism are a bunch of deluded middle-class hypocrites who are trying to inflict a guilt trip on the rest of society.

by ««««««««« Sat Jun 24, 2006 11:14

- don't let people ignore you

by Caitriona Fri Jun 23, 2006 16:58

Forgot to post that photos taken by William Hederman.