8th Wise Woman Weekend, Dromahair, Leitrim, May 25-27 2012

by scepticwomyn Thu Apr 19, 2012 20:02

Not bullying anyone etc etc.. Thats just you "mud slinging". (Somewhat hypocritically I might add!) I was Merely assertively expressing my distaste at the usual stereotypes of women being daft and irrational being propagated yet again by another "mystical" event. This is the kind of thing that feeds into women being taken less seriously in society hence my points. I have to deal with the consequences of these stereotypes every day so I have a right to express my lack of enthusiasm at more ammunition being generated. I'm not stopping anyone attending this event. However personally I'd recommend buying a science book and maybe reading that instead.

by Aletta Thu Apr 19, 2012 13:15

I'm amazed and appalled by the so-called 'feminist' negativity and hatred being vented at the organisers of this weekend. I don't know what it has to do with improving anyone's lot, be it the poor homeless woman down the road or poor people in general, or what. What's the use in throwing mud at people who probably agree with some, at least, of your view points? Having been involved in political and lobbying activity at most stages in my long life (and having been poor, most of my life), I feel that this person that is so full of venom and hatred is not going to make one bit of difference to anyone or any cause. The kind of negative and abusive language used by her simply leads to more anger and futher abuse. I would advise this person to start undertaking plenty of positive action using inspiring words - a lot - over many years of toil - then look at others and support rather than bully them, even if they try to do something positive in other ways than your own. Save your breath for worthy causes and towards positive outcomes! Know also that, beside your own cause, there are many more very needy causes and let it be hoped that no-one is abusing you for not actively supporting their causes, you'd have not a moment's breath in your life.

Thank you, women who responded to all this bullying and hatred, you kept cool and calm, well done! As for a women-only weekend, this is, after all a Wise Woman event... Mixed events are also great, but this just ain't one of them.

by Man. Mon Apr 16, 2012 20:22

Well, if Judith Hoad is part of this, then that is enough for me. A great human being, let there be no doubt.

by Judith Hoad - Wise Woman Organising Team Mon Apr 16, 2012 18:20

Let's stop the cynicism and the scepticism about the Wise Woman Weekend - it hasn't been going for eight years because it's a failure! Every year a nucleus of woman have been present who have attended before and every time friendships have been forged with and among all the women who are new to the event..

There is a mighty dynamic in mixed gender events; there's a mighty dynamic in all-male events; there's a mighty dynamic in all-female events - they're all mighty, but in very different ways. Why is it cause for adverse comment that only women attend the Wise Woman event? It's great fun, it's a chance to learn something new, it's a chance to make a difference. Come and experience it, complete with its mighty and special dynamic. Come and mix, make a difference and learn something - more like many things - that is/are new to you.

by Man. Mon Apr 16, 2012 17:17

A very secular "alleluia" to that.

by opus diablos - the regressive hypocrite party Mon Apr 16, 2012 17:04

Balance in all things..the women have a war of their own against a paternalistic (at best)society...but many of them forget 90% of men are also victims of this competitive rat-race, and that many of the top-dog men running it are egged on by greedy women.

They also forget us male chauvenist pigs get raised mostly by women...ahem girls, poppa is usually down a mine or offshore if he can get work, or locked into an office for the sunlit hours...again simplifications are seldom accurate representations.

Maybe the way to unify and end the gender wars is to focus on the blameless kids we catapult into the increasingly septic world.

The women should set up The Kiddies Party...and expose the juvenile and adolescent gobshites running our planet.

Wonder what they think?

by Man. Mon Apr 16, 2012 16:20

I think we are close in our views. Back to the women.
I look forward to my query regarding exclusivity-genderwise-being addressed.

by opus diablos - the regressive hypocrite party Mon Apr 16, 2012 16:03

..have their place.

But it is not as arbiter; that is the job of the reflective intelligence.

Science, to function in a balanced holistic human fashion, needs the constant reassessment of conscience...i.e. counter-science and dialectical development towards ever-refining( sometimes through reductions)understanding.

To overvalue sentiment and emotion can be dangerously anti-intellectual, a sure road to fascistic superstition and pseudo-scientific absolute-truth worship.

But lets not hog the women's space.

by Man. Mon Apr 16, 2012 15:32

Science is about scepticism, evidence, the ongoing approximations in the search for relative truths, always, if properly practised, posited on the presumption of one's own fallibility and openess to peer feedback and review.

I wholeheartedly agree with the above; however, Science is "owned" by Capital and serves its purpose. In it's pure sense, Science is great, but that is all too rare.
Sentiment and emotion are important and it is only by the integration of that with Science we can get authenticity.

by opus diablos - the regressive hypocrite party Mon Apr 16, 2012 15:00

...the bleak and irrational religion that is science????????

Science is about scepticism, evidence, the ongoing approximations in the search for relative truths, always, if properly practised, posited on the presumption of one's own fallibility and openess to peer feedback and review.

Religion is a different kettle, don't be misleading the uninformed.

I'm with freya and scepticwomyn, they seem to have the necessary proverbial tittle of wit.

by Man. Mon Apr 16, 2012 12:52

"it just feeds into the negative stereotype of women being daft and irrational. Surely you could just have a group weekend at a spa or something if you want to recharge your batteries with a bunch of other women?. There's no need for the pseudo scientfic mystical bullshit element."

As a man I have to say that it sounds great and maybe an antidote to the reductionistic, bleak and irrational religion that is Science. Connecting with the Earth is great by me and necessary for our survival; however, having it female only is a drawback.

by scepticwomyn Sun Apr 15, 2012 07:46

Thanks very much for the generous offer but frankly, the "chalice of grace" sounds like it's full of snake oil, dreams are just the brain integrating events of the day with the rest of your memory fragments, I have a perfectly good rattle already which I share with my 2 year old, I don't believe you can communicate with the ancestors or any other dead people for that matter except maybe one way through their written words, root chakra my arse!, I'm already down to earth with my feet planted firmly in reality thanks, and energy healing sounds like more snake oil. Exactly what forms of energy are we talkng about here? Electrical? nuclear? I'd consider the art class as that sounds ok but that alone does not justify the huge fee so I'll pass. However, do consider giving a donation to this website if you have that much to spare! Or maybe buy a poor homeless woman a decent dinner and perhaps a night or two in a B&B. A better way to spend the money in my opinion.

enjoy your weekend, but personally I can't take it seriously. It just feeds into the negative stereotype of women being daft and irrational. Surely you could just have a group weekend at a spa or something if you want to recharge your batteries with a bunch of other women?. There's no need for the pseudo scientfic mystical bullshit element.

by Freya Sun Apr 15, 2012 02:06

i would also point out that two nights in a decent b and b costs at least thirty euro a night a meal about the same thats ninety euro already so your left with thirty five euro for the actual event..only a few people go to the event so thats just barely covering the cost of transporting the people who are sharing their skills... so i really think its out of touch to say that 125 is incredibly dear for a weekend anywhere. {even at home!

But the accommodation and food is on top of the €125, Even the Saturday veggie dinner is €15 extra. Looks as if theres some Wise Women around getting volunteers to do the workshops.

Where does the money go? The venue can't justify the cost.

You know the Mafia are known as Wiseguys?

by eli - none Sat Apr 14, 2012 13:56

i think i am argueing a little here but ill chance it anyway:0 it can be hard to see why things like knitting and poetry are important when everyone is angry about money..but there is always a degree of repression and has been since we became a society. it may get better and worse through time just as our living situation or economic situation can go up and down in our lives. the inportant thing about rattle making ..or knitting or any other "womens work" is not the rattle itself, obviously its a fairly useless thing to shake at a politician if your trying to start a revolution!!.. but in learning to make a rattle together..{which ive never done but have done even "sillier" things like crotchet!} you learn a lot more than rattling. all the workshops are just decoration for the real work and learning that goes on in groups of women. what that learning is you would probably have to experience for yourself. i think there is definitly a need for learning about politics and using the personal empowerment to influence the world around you in a way that is true to our feminine nature. which is often not protesting the system but creating alternatives such as swap shops recycling and other things to overcome our economic state while at the same time forming social bonding through working together. if you have insight into the political maybe you could go to the womens weekend and share that wisdom and help to spread interest among the women there in politics and social and economic form..perhaps they dont know the skills to do this ..i think a lot of us are at aloss ...maybe you could look into bringing some of your passion for womens activism to the wise women event and telling them whats what... in a respectful way of course

. i would also point out that two nights in a decent b and b costs at least thirty euro a night a meal about the same thats ninety euro already so your left with thirty five euro for the actual event..only a few people go to the event so thats just barely covering the cost of transporting the people who are sharing their skills... so i really think its out of touch to say that 125 is incredibly dear for a weekend anywhere. {even at home!}

i would love to see the aspect of politics and activism come into the world of wise women ....the strength one gets from night after night of knitting doesnt show in the fluffy jumper that you make but it will be very usefull to have that patience, perseverence and attention to detail when the time comes to rise from the knitting seat and put those skills into action to change our world. and sometimes the active male part of us, the action and protest part of us, can learn a lot from the feminine strengths. learning about our female elders past times and the secrets behind them..... secrets that you cant see from looking from the outside.

i would like to offer to pay for your ticket to the wise women weekend if you promise that you will prepare some information about things we as women can learn to help in political activism... and if you promise to make the rattle and listen to the elders. because i have been given so much and i would like to pay it forward to someone who i think sounds quite like me...in fact i didnt look at your name and im just laughing thinking "maybe...did i write that?...did i write that and forget?" now that would be funny if i offered to pay for msyelf to go to it lol!! that would be irony...i would have agreed with you before i experienced it for myself and i would have been pissed off that my voice wasnt represented so you go and represent the voice of revolution for me and let us know what you learn :) and some day youll help someone go to something they feel they cant afford too:) .....

rainbow drops and yoghurt pots fuel the revolutionary plot:)

by Niamh Dempsey Sat Apr 14, 2012 09:38

I understand that there is huge anger in society, and at the systems that oppress. I spent many years spitting vitriol and hating. It was only through Shamanic work that I was able to move through my own trauma, clear myself of anger and start to step into my power as a woman.

This year, I am facilitating the Shamanic Rattle Making workshop at Wise Woman Weekend, hoping to help empower other women to find their strength to take action.

I attended the weekend two years ago, and made great connections with women with whom I am still involved in various projects, including Transition Initiatives, the anti-fracking movement and the Wise Woman Weekend organising team. It was money well spent.

It is one thing to know what you are against, but quite another to know what you are for.

The example of the Arpilleras movement in Chile is one of women getting together and simply sewing quilts. In time this grew to be one of the strongest political movements against the brutal regime of Pinochet. There is a real power in gathering in safe and sacred space as women together to share skills and stories and just to be in sisterhood.

by Rachel Webb - The Wise Woman Weekend Fri Apr 13, 2012 21:35

Our Wise Woman Weekend takes huge amounts of time and energy – joyously given because we care about each other, women in general, and the planet. But its not the only thing we do.

The women who organise this weekend are workers in many professions: artists, political activists, writers, mothers, nurses, teachers, social workers, counsellors etc. Our participants come from anywhere and everywhere. They pay the money because its worth it to them, and they come back again because it gives them something intangible and valuable. Others are unemployed but save up for months because they know this weekend will refresh and empower them.

Often we cannot get together to work on the weekend because we don’t have the money for petrol, but we need to believe that this joyful and profoundly renewing event is still possible – in spite of all our current difficulties. We try to cover lots of different angles with our workshops, and not everyone wants the same stuff. As a feminist I know that the personal is political, that women coming together in sisterhood to find strength and affirmation in their individuality is powerful. This power can then be used by individual women in any way they choose.

Many of the same women who organise or attend the weekend are currently battling against the possibility of fracking in North West Ireland. We are dealing with increased levels of depression, debt and hardship. The Wise Woman Weekend is time out of the battle. Re-creation.

Nobody has to come. Nobody has to do any particular workshop. We are multifaceted beings, there is room for us to work and play, to feed our bodies, minds and spirits, to fight and to dance.

Feminism is surely about every woman supporting every other woman to make her own choices, to be respected, to be free to express herself and her humanity as she chooses. That’s what we are doing with the Wise Woman Weekend – alongside the other ways we are doing it for the other 362 days of the year.

by scepticwomyn Fri Apr 13, 2012 17:38

Hmm...seems to me that if you really wanted to empower women then rather than holding daft events such as "Shamanic Rattle Making " or "Introduction to Energy Healing " or "Writing the Book of the Ancestors "

you would instead be helping to organise and unite them politically against the various targetted economic onslaughts against women including increasing austerity attacks that are particularly hitting women and children, Also the continuous social attacks such as the relentless portrayal of women in media and popular culture as idiots and objects, attacks that that are setting back womens liberation to the stone age.

You only had to look on the streets on st patricks night to see how deeply and negatively these social forces have influenced young girls.

Then of course you have the vintners lobbying groups trying to soften the recent alcohol and substance abuse report wording regarding alcohol as a huge factor in rape.

It seems to me that women need more important skills than "shamanic rattle making" in our society right now. Skills such as those needed to organise and co-ordinate in the fight for social and economic justice. Real knowledge and help in understanding the insidious undermining of their social position and respect in this society by the forces of capitalism.

Apart from the exhorbitant entrance fee, This "festival" seems like a daft quackish distraction to reality and not what women really need right now. But then again at 125 euro a pop, in these harsh economic times, it will probably only be the bored cossetted wives of the rich that will be attending this , and much of what I referred to above does not really apply to those people does it?

Good luck fiddling while the lives of women in Ireland burn

by Orfhlaith Ni Chonaill - Wise Woman Ireland Fri Apr 13, 2012 16:38 info at wisewomanireland dot org

At €125 the Wise Woman Weekend is great value for money. Where would you get three such interesting workshops, two nights' entertainment, the company of mighty women and a beautiful celebration of Bealtaine for less than that? If the organisers could run this event on love alone, believe me, they would!

It costs money to run an event. And luckily, so far we have managed to balance our outgoings with our incomings. Although we usually have some hairy moments worrying whether we are going to have enough people to break even. We pay for venues, advertising, insurance, postage and telephone, website costs, and accommodation and food for our guest facilitators and volunteers. And we put in copious amounts of our own precious time because the Wise Woman Weekend is something we are passionate about!

Wise Woman Ireland is a group of women, most of whom were facilitators who gave workshops for free at the Wise Woman Weekend in Leitrim. When the weekend was threatened with closure I, personally, stepped forward and volunteered myself as co-ordinator of this group of volunteers. I can absolutely assure any critics that the motivation behind this group of women is altruistic, generous and enthusiastic for the betterment of women and the planet. Our only payback is the great craic that is had by all at the weekend.

The Wise Woman Weekend is a non profit making event. Our decision to register as a charity is partly motivated by our wish that our accounts should be completely transparent. As a registered charity we will be subject to an annual audit.

by scepticwomyn Fri Apr 13, 2012 05:28

125 euro? bit steep isn't it, given it runs on volunteer energy!!. Is this just commercial exploitative quackery? Where does all the money go?